[RSQ3John]

I'm enjoying the current RS, have no change pressure, owned outright and with a little less than 4 yrs warranty remaining but find myself idly wondering what the next car will be. I've said previously that the RS will be the last ICE vehicle I'll own and I've made no secret of the fact that I took quite a bit of interest in the Kia EV6...glad I didn't jump as there seem to be quite a few software bugs.

I've read that later this year Audi are planning a Q6 launch (around the same size of a Q5) which will be a pure EV built on an 800volt architecture with a 380-400 mile range - most likely on a warm day! I get all the concerns over charging infrastructure but figure I rarely drive more than 300 miles in a day mostly starting and returning back to home - car is garaged so charging overnight is a none-issue. So a real-world 300 mile range EV would work for me...

Is anyone else indulging in a spot of fence-sitting?

 

[Tigre64]

Yep firmly on the fence collecting splinters 🤣 and watching with interest. My q3 sline will also more than likely be my last ICE. But whilst there are a few good candidates out there, EV6, Ioniq5, q4 for example, charging infrastructure is still far from where it needs to be, battery technology is not quite there, in terms of efficiency, the average mile per kWh I would think needs to be double (or more) the current average figures, just adding bigger batteries just adds more weight. (And therefore makes better efficiency hard to obtain)
Wltp range is imho a useless calculation, which manufacturers exploit in their favour, and any wltp figure should be reduced by at least 25 to 30%. Things can only get better and I hope by 2025 Manufacturers will be producing EVs that don’t increase driver angst over range, 400+ real miles on a single charge should be the absolute minimum.

 

[PWS]

Not sure about 'fence-sitting' but I'm on a related glidepath, albeit with different requirements. I'd be 100% happy to order an EV now; I follow the EV market quite closely and appreciate that a lot of the criticism of range, infrastructure etc is in the rearview mirror now, but with the proviso that you need to be able to charge at home.

But there isn't an EV currently that really ticks all the boxes for me.- other than the city cars, all the more premium models are too large and too heavy for my taste. I know I'm a bit odd in preferring smaller cars - even a Q3 is slightly larger than I'd ideally like. Modern packaging means that a 4.3-4.4m (sub-)compact SUV/crossover can comfortably hold 4 adults and/or a reasonable amount of cargo. and also offer 4WD and be pretty nimble & chuckable on the road.

Nearest I've come across in a BEV is a Cupra Born, but the 4WD version still seems to be some way off - probably announced later this year with 2023 delivery at a guess. But by all accounts the VAG software (though not necessarily the Audi version) still needs quite a bit more shaking down and I'm not sure anyway how sensible it is to order a new variant in say the first 6-12 months of production. Waiting a bit might also improve the battery tech slightly and give somewhat better power or energy density, ideally both. That said, I don't think there are going to be step changes in batteries in the near future and anyway manufacturers might well use any such benefits to reduce kerb weight rather than increase range. An increase in EV efficiency to reach say current Tesla Model 3 LR benchmarks is perhaps also a realistic aim worth waiting for - seems to be happening slowly and incrementally with eg OTA updates but Tesla still sets the targets.

So what I'm currently considering is ordering a Mini Countryman JCW (not very different in concept to a BMW SQ3) as an interim next ICE car and then look to make the EV jump after that. (Though if Lexus were to introduce a UX model with the P810 eCVT drivetrain in the near future then I'd certainly give that a test.)

 

[spike107]

I've been watching on Quest the new fifth gear "recharged"... They had the Cupra Born, EV6 and Ioniq5 reviews all in there if your intersted... Its certainly got me on the fence as to what to replace my 8U RSQ3 with for sure...

 

[Idiocratease]

I'm enjoying the current RS, have no change pressure, owned outright and with a little less than 4 yrs warranty remaining but find myself idly wondering what the next car will be. I've said previously that the RS will be the last ICE vehicle I'll own and I've made no secret of the fact that I took quite a bit of interest in the Kia EV6...glad I didn't jump as there seem to be quite a few software bugs.

I've read that later this year Audi are planning a Q6 launch (around the same size of a Q5) which will be a pure EV built on an 800volt architecture with a 380-400 mile range - most likely on a warm day! I get all the concerns over charging infrastructure but figure I rarely drive more than 300 miles in a day mostly starting and returning back to home - car is garaged so charging overnight is a none-issue. So a real-world 300 mile range EV would work for me...

Is anyone else indulging in a spot of fence-sitting?

I too think about EV, but will be waiting a while… I would like to see a bit more life cycle info on batteries, and also how the technology improves, but mostly I would like to wait for self driving to be a bit more useable… maybe another 5 years of so… but It is on my mind…

 

[mwcltd]

I would not consider purchasing an EV until the battery technology and the infrastructure catches up with the application. If you must be eco and save money then I would go for a hybrid as typically 90% plus of our journeys are less than 20 miles.

 

[DavidS]

Or just travel less?
With two cars and two motorcycles, I probably haven’t done much more than 5000 miles since Covid hit.
Mind you, we flew to South Africa for a holiday three weeks before and got home three days before lockdown.
Bang go the eco credentials I never had.

 

[Noggin]

I Don't know if driving petrol cars for over 60 years has had the effect of making me resistant to change but I have recently been testing out some EV and hybrid cars (Audi and VW ) with a view to going Eco friendly. However I have to say that I have not enjoyed them at all . Ok I may be a dinosaur, but to me, yes they accelerate like nitrogenous deposit off a steel shod digging implement but that's it, and that's not my style of driving. My disenchantment started when I was walking to the VW ID4 and noticed the industrial nature of the tyres it was shod with . This fed through to the brake effort needed to pull the thing down from speed . It just felt that you were driving a ton and a half of car with another ton of battery ballast along for the ride. It felt more like rocket propelled missile due to the large kinetic energy It had stored on board, and your extermination was only being constrained by the efficiency of the anchors, I had expected the car to be constrained by the energy recovery system but no , I would have hated to get it on an icy road, hello landscape , here I come ! The Q3e much the same but not quite so bad, they just did not ride and handle as I wanted . The Q3e I tested only had a half full battery but the rate this emptied was alarming and this on a short test drive.
To me a lot of development and refining would be necessary for me to buy one , something for the later generations.

 

[Tomduck]

I Don't know if driving petrol cars for over 60 years has had the effect of making me resistant to change but I have recently been testing out some EV and hybrid cars (Audi and VW ) with a view to going Eco friendly. However I have to say that I have not enjoyed them at all . Ok I may be a dinosaur, but to me, yes they accelerate like nitrogenous deposit off a steel shod digging implement but that's it, and that's not my style of driving. My disenchantment started when I was walking to the VW ID4 and noticed the industrial nature of the tyres it was shod with . This fed through to the brake effort needed to pull the thing down from speed . It just felt that you were driving a ton and a half of car with another ton of battery ballast along for the ride. It felt more like rocket propelled missile due to the large kinetic energy It had stored on board, and your extermination was only being constrained by the efficiency of the anchors, I had expected the car to be constrained by the energy recovery system but no , I would have hated to get it on an icy road, hello landscape , here I come ! The Q3e much the same but not quite so bad, they just did not ride and handle as I wanted . The Q3e I tested only had a half full battery but the rate this emptied was alarming and this on a short test drive.
To me a lot of development and refining would be necessary for me to buy one , something for the later generations.

That’s more or less my summary too. Happy to wait til they produce something more sophisticated but in no rush at all to ditch ICE

 

[spike]

Seems to be a down side to everything
Are electric cars the new ‘diesel scandal’ waiting to happen?- Bjorn Lomborg | NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE KNOW THAT (wordpress.com)

Cheers Spike

 

[PWS]

Please, that's an article parroting Lomborg, one of the least credible voices on any environmental matter. It's like promoting Donald Trump or Lukashenko as the world's foremost expert on running fair elections (and accepting their result gracefully).

Of course EVs generate some particulate pollution eg in the form of tyre dust and, if you regularly user an EV's rapid acceleration, that might well be more than a similar car, EV or fossil , driven more sedately. But most other forms of particulate emission will be lower with an EV, unless you live eg in a country that still uses lignite-burning to generate electricity (Germany we're looking at you in particular, and Poland to a lesser extent). For instance, brake dust will typically be much less on an EV, assuming that regen braking is used to a reasonable extent.

 

[DavidS]

Devils advocate time…..
Tyre degradation and subsequent pollution has been an alleged eco issue for a long time so, where does adding, say, 300kg(?) to the weight of every new car take tyre wear, road surface damage etc.
To me, an EV’s only USP seems to be ‘zero’ tailpipe emissions, which is of excellent value to urban areas but minimal use in the rest of the country/world. If we can get to 100% ecologically sound electricity generation then that will help but it looks like it will still be environmentally more expensive to build and dispose of an EV vehicle for some considerable time yet.

What will the sad morons who turn up half an hour early at our nearby school to get a good parking spot do in winter when they sit there with their engines running to keep warm? The poor loves might have to get a life or go for a walk.

Sorry…feeling mildly ranty today. Getting fed up with being preached to.

 

[Tomduck]

Devils advocate time…..
Tyre degradation and subsequent pollution has been an alleged eco issue for a long time so, where does adding, say, 300kg(?) to the weight of every new car take tyre wear, road surface damage etc.
To me, an EV’s only USP seems to be ‘zero’ tailpipe emissions, which is of excellent value to urban areas but minimal use in the rest of the country/world. If we can get to 100% ecologically sound electricity generation then that will help but it looks like it will still be environmentally more expensive to build and dispose of an EV vehicle for some considerable time yet.

What will the sad morons who turn up half an hour early at our nearby school to get a good parking spot do in winter when they sit there with their engines running to keep warm? The poor loves might have to get a life or go for a walk.

Sorry…feeling mildly ranty today. Getting fed up with being preached to.

There’s an element that they are “flavour of the month”, but of course the fact you remove them burning fossil fuel over the long term means they are on balance more environmentally friendly, although I don’t think it’s chalk n cheese when you factor in the downsides of EVs you mention. Once you come down to it the worse thing for the environment is more people being born each year, we are in effect on a collision course with population overload at some point in thousands of years time. We all consume and if you look at the crap we all buy today (especially for children) it’s truly frightening. If you look at the amount of real recycling therein also lies a problem, far less than people think is recycled, it’s just a problem we shift elsewhere.

For me personally I will stick with ICE until I have to or the range is substantially better to negate charging up outside of my home, I fully expect in 10 years time current EVs to be largely superseded with far better battery technology.

 

[Tigre64]

This is worth viewing, I thought it was quite balanced, given that Rory is all for EVs

There are quite a few good reports from him on the YouTube autotrader channel.

 

[Malph]

This is worth a watch for anyone considering an EV. Not exactly a 'cutting edge' experiment, but really emphasises the shortcomings of an EV, especially regarding range.

 

[Tomduck]

I’ll stick to the technology I know and trust in which I have maximum confidence 🤓 ICE

 

[simonali]

The_Void

6uild 6ack 6etter

t.me

 

[RSQ3John]

EVs are getting so common - Tesla Model 3s are everywhere (still don't like the shape),,,I keep looking, Ford Mustang Mach-e GT would do.

 

[alanyork]

wife has a countryman cooper S hybrid , (to Us) better than full electric,

 

[PWS]

EVs are getting so common - Tesla Model 3s are everywhere (still don't like the shape),,,I keep looking, Ford Mustang Mach-e GT would do.

As a reminder, I've got a pre-order in on a Genesis GV60, though can't decide between Sport (314bhp) and Sport Plus (420ish bhp) trims I suspect that the Sport is fast enough for me (ca 5s 0-60) but the Sport Plus has some extra features that sound appealing and gets 0-60 down to around 4s. Both are max torque iof 600Nm (or 700 on the Plus with the Boost button active for 10s). I'm not sure that the shape of any modern SUVs - or many EVs in general come to that - will win many beauty contests, but personally I find the styling and more compact dimensions of the GV60 acceptable to my eye. Genesis are still being a bit vague about delivery except that first UK deliveries will be from June onwards and then I guess it depends on where you are in the queue, but I'm thinking 6 months probably.

Still waiting for the configurator to appear though apparently it is imminent. I do have a (Canadian!) PDF copy of the brochure - PM me if it's of any interest.